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20 May 2008
The UK government is planning a huge database that would hold details of all phone calls, text messages, emails and internet use of every UK citizen.
The database is being touted as a way to combat terrorism and will be introduced in a new Communications Data Bill planned for the Queen's Speech in November.
Information would be held for 12 months and could be accessed by police and security services in possession of a court order.
"We have warned before that we are sleepwalking into a surveillance society, " said assistant Information Commissioner Jonathan Bamford.
"Holding large collections of data is always risky. The more data that is collected and stored, the bigger the problem when the data is lost, traded or stolen.
"Defeating crime and terrorism is of the utmost importance, but we are not aware of any pressing need to justify the government holding this sort of data. "
Technology companies have been quick to challenge the move, pointing out that such a vast database would be immensely difficult to manage, would be a boon to identity thieves and would do little to counter terrorism.
Jamie Cowper, a data protection and encryption expert at PGP Corporation, said: "You have to admire the government's gall in attempting to bring in yet another 'super-database' with public confidence still in tatters over recent data lapses.
"Surely it would be more logical to focus on fixing the existing databases and proving their security before introducing new ones.
"The bottom line is that information of this nature should only be held if it can be demonstrated that an appropriate system of checks and balances is in place and the security of the information being stored is of paramount concern. "
The unprecedented amount of data to be stored and analysed has raised particular concerns.
Over 50 billion text messages are sent each year in the UK, and over three billion emails are sent every day.
"The database would have to manage exponentially growing volumes of 'unstructured' data," said Chris Dean, director at independent IT consultancy DWM Group.
"The huge amount of information generated by emails, phone calls and web browsing will make the task of collating and retrieving information on demand enormous.
"Unless very carefully designed [this database] could become a white elephant because of performance problems."
The proposals will face a rough ride getting through parliament. Shadow Home Secretary David Davis has referred to the database as more of a threat than a support in stopping crime, and Liberal Democrats have pledged to fight the moves.
"Ministers have taken leave of their senses if they think that this proposal is compatible with a free country and a free people," said Liberal Democrat Shadow Home Secretary Chris Huhne.
"Given its appalling track record of data loss, this government simply cannot be trusted with private information. This is an Orwellian step too far."
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Do you agree?
terrorism an excuse
This is an incideos erosion of civil liberties and to use terrorism and crime as an excuse to store this information doesnt fool anyone. Its a sledgehammer to crack a nut. And what bothers me even more is how this information is used in years to come it can be open to abuse. This isnt a free country The government are no better than the kgb
Posted by: reiss 06 Apr 2009
They already filter communication
"Maybe they could try something like findind a way to "filter" information, collect only that information which contains words connected to crime or terrorism." They already do that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON There is no end to the hunger for the invasion and control of citizen's communications (=lives). This needs to stop now. Safeguarding the fundamental principles of a free society (such as privacy, imho) is more important than catching any number of terrorists, since without a free society we have nothing.
Posted by: phil 22 Sep 2008
We've got it back-to-front
As usual they are targetting the wrong people. They need to direct their efforts to: identifying the baddies, locating them and arresting them; they do NOT need to gather information on the entire population in order to do this. We must resist this intrusion into our privacy, or end up being the most regulated, spyed upon society ever known. Write or speak to your MP and tell him/her that you will not tolerate it. Remember, the politicians are there to serve YOU, not the other way round. Do not submit meekly to this kind of oppression. Protest!
Posted by: Paul 09 Sep 2008
We're all sleepwalkers.
If the government wants to do it, they'll do it. There have been no clashes in the streets over the proposed identity cards. No one has really protested about cctv. The system would be designed to only be on the look out for trigger words that supposed terrorists would use. Messages with those words would be flagged for further investigation. So, don't send a message expressing concern over animal rights, the need to bring troops home or anything denouncing nuclear power stations. You will be seen as a potential terrorist worthy of closer watching.
Posted by: Martin. 17 Jun 2008
Just prey your name isnt Buttle or is it Tuttle?
This is like something out of Brazil, no govt that even proposes something like this is worth the steam off anyone's piss.
Posted by: Aiki 22 May 2008
Logging All Data?
OK... and all it takes to take down a stupid idea like this, is for everybody (or a large contingent) to set aside a day(s) to text, email, download etc (get the idea?) like crazy on specified days - and the cyber government walls come tumbling down... I still think some of these dim sparks in governmental circles, are still residing (mentally) in the 'good old days'... which incidentally, have never been, never were, and never will be... for goodness sake, how street\web\mobile cred are some of these dozy cretins?!
Posted by: San 21 May 2008
it's tyranny and it'll get worse.
how long are people going to take this before they recognise it for what it is..........tyranny. and unlike the americans who have the right to arms so that they can protect themselves and their family against tyranny, that right was given to them after they expelled the british when they tried to turn them into slaves. So unlike the u.s we'll be totally at the mercy of the globalists in charge and their minions, the police.
Posted by: simon lomax 21 May 2008
Crazy
To think that everyone will sit back and let this happen the goverment must be run by loonys And for them to think they could actually get this system to work they must be even more deluded the sheer amount of data they are talking about is massive it would cost tens of millions to set up and run if it was possible for it to work all payed for by us lol
Posted by: None of your bussiness 21 May 2008
Big Brother?
I don't agree with the government's decision to log phone calls, e-mails and text messages at all. I think that action goes against every citizen's right for privacy. What's next? A screen at every person's home as in Orwell's story? If they do this to stop terrorism, fine, but they need to find some alternative. Maybe they could try something like findind a way to "filter" information, collect only that information which contains words connected to crime or terrorism.
Posted by: MJ 21 May 2008
No way
Privacy would be diminished , you really think this database will be secure enough , i mean how many of you text a loved one or a family member about private things , well now that wont be the case another 500 ofice workers looking at theeses texts would also see what your up to , i dont think this omes in and im off the web , my phones and anything there tracing us on , this is ludicrus
Posted by: Matt 21 May 2008
what privacy in the uk?
unbeliveable !!! next the govt will want to install cctv in every home, for 'our own saftey' & for national security reasons. (wait 'n see)
Posted by: sabah 21 May 2008
1984
Was written as a warning to us all, not an instruction manual for (Za)NuLab
Posted by: urban 21 May 2008
Crazy.
If this goes through the next thing would be addition of"The Second Ammendment" added to the UK's constitution. This is real overkill.
Posted by: Christopher Neal 21 May 2008
privacy intrusion
Is this another move under the frankfurt subversion agenda by the EU?
Posted by: G. Forshaw 21 May 2008
Government to log every phone call, email and text
Ther government is full of advisors etc. They will know how unpopular/unfeasible/impossible this is. What's happening is that the govt is telling potential terrorists (albeit at a very low level) that they have no chance because we will get you. We have just ruined that by this posting and discusion.
Posted by: Tony Lunney 21 May 2008
No, No, No!!
We should take to the sreets if the Brown Government attempts to pass this Bill through Parliament they must be stopped at all costs.
Posted by: Jeff Nesbitt 20 May 2008
A total waste of time and tax payers money
It will grow into a monster, and it will cost the taxpayer billions, just think of how many emails are sent each day? not to mention the spam, and of course the legal implications, is the government suddenly immune from copyright laws and the human rights acts? Plus it will never work, there will just be a massive rise in unbreakable encryption systems... I know I could easily do all communication in a way the government could never read it, so whats to stop a criminal doing so?
Posted by: Chris 20 May 2008
Welcome to 1984
if you haven't read the book, in the hellish Nazi version, the government reads all letters, monitors all phone traffic.
Posted by: William Jones 20 May 2008
whatever....
soom, we will have cameras in the toilets to make sure that we are using the right amount of toilet paper... and if were not then the police will come knocking, give us a fine of £60 and a caution to how long i can have a s*it for.... as if the government isnt tracking what we are doing now... this whole big brother things is ridiculous, why dont they keep tabs on people they suspect to be "terrorist" and leave us alone to enjoy life without having to think that we are being watched on every step we take.....
Posted by: And1234 20 May 2008
It Just goes to show
How can the government think that this is a great idea in even the slightest aspect? I mean just the cost alone of maintaining such a database is ridiculous, not to mention the people you would have to employ to decipher all that information. Granted, that would create jobs, but then again, it would also cost us taxpayers copious amounts of our already heavily taxed pay checks. Then there's shear issue of morality. Why should we give up the last little bits of privacy that we as citizens have left simply so the government can attempt to keep us safe. Any information stored on such a database would only aid terrorists and criminals. Now instead of attacking multiple targets to steal someone's identity, all you have to do is hack one database to obtain mass amounts of information on not just one person, but millions. Indeed, the entire population. A ridiculous idea. I hope the PM and his Ministers come to thier senses.
Posted by: Bradley Cranford 20 May 2008
This is too far.
There is a dystopia looming.
Posted by: John Doe 20 May 2008
It would be the government...
yet another terrible idea from the government. That book called 1984 or whatever it was will come true soon! it wont be long before everyone must be inside before 9pm or we will be shot dead! It makes me laugh how the government are incapable of storing existing data yet want everything we have as members of the public! - It was about 3 months ago I read that the UK has the most skilled workers emigrating out of any country in the world...they must have seen sense. Did anyone think about the terrorists posting letters - next they will have to rip open and photocopy our letters! Think of how many spam emails would end up being kept! there would be at least 20 million penis enlargement ones!
Posted by: Chris 20 May 2008
"Last Enemy" anyone?
I seem to remember watching a TV series not so very long ago that highlighted the dangers of a system just like this!
Posted by: KH 20 May 2008
**** off
I think the title says it all. I can't be bothered to speak rationally when things like this are being proposed. This is ridiculous. Terrorism is only a front for a dystopian society.
Posted by: John Galt 20 May 2008
Big Brother
Hey GOV if your reading this, stick to roads and the nhs and keep your nose out of my business
Posted by: Mr Bush 20 May 2008
1984 or 2008
Britain used to be the model of democracy, no longer. Where is privacy in all this? rism is evil, wrong and must be defeated, but democracy and freedom must not be sacrificed to achieve it. If it is, have not the terrorists then won? The volume of 'unstruictured' data this woiuld entail would only prove impossible to research and analyse i any plausible time frme to prove helpful. Should such data ever fall into wrong hands it would further the causes of terrorism rather than help defeat them. Britain is the home of the free and MUST remain so! Further restrict our liberties is like an act terrorism itself, no?
Posted by: Robert Paine 20 May 2008
NHS DB years behind. How long for yet another DBASE? 30 yrs?
The biggest data collection in progress is the NHS medical data collection about everyone. This is several years behind schedule already. It also eats up resources and money. We can rest assured that it will take 20 years to get the proposed communications data collection system going. By that time the data volume will be so large that the system will crash under its own weight. Then we will need a new one, another 20 years later, a bit like Heathrow. Keeps IT consultants busy. Why not have a culling of government IT consultants instead and spend the money saved on more conventional investigation methods?
Posted by: Ernst Rupprecht 20 May 2008